Petition for music on TV

Making music programming on TV has by now become a desperate undertaking. The last protected oasis – “Ghiaccio Bollente”, airing around midnight on Rai 5 – was unexpectedly swept away just a few days ago. News that came like a bolt from the blue for everyone who saw in Carlo Massarini's program the natural heir to classics like “Per voi giovani”, “DOC”, “Mister Fantasy” or the original “Discoring”. A program that was anything but nostalgic, though, thanks to its direct line to contemporary music – from rock to blues, from jazz to folk. And its formidable late-night companion piece should also vanish from our screens, made up of a steady stream of unmissable concerts and music documentaries. “Where else? Tonight the last and final episode of ‪#Ghiaccio Bollente Magazine, exceptionally on Rai 5 at 23.08”, Massarini wrote on his Facebook page. But that's not the end of it, because a petition has been launched on Change.org, which in just two days has already gathered 19,000 signatures against the show's cancellation. And a mobilization has arisen that also calls into question the fraught relationship between TV and culture. We talk about all this (and more) with Carlo Massarini.

Carlo, can we start by recapping what's happening with “Ghiaccio Bollente”?

They ended the show without giving us any explanation, just sending us a terse email thanking us for the work done. The last episode aired yesterday (Tuesday 22 December, ed.), and my hosting duties for the evening broadcasts end on the 26th. I know that in January they'll carry on with reruns, and then the schedule calls for it to be discontinued.

What about the promise that the show won't close and will even get a primetime slot in the spring, announced on Rai 5's Facebook page?

Yesterday morning they made that announcement in a tweet, but I think it was simply a move to contain a protest that was building up in a truly unexpected way. It's no coincidence that no further statement has been made since then. I don't know what they have in mind, but it looks to me like a flimsy attempt to divert attention.

How did the idea for the petition come about, and how many signatures have been collected so far?

The idea for the petition came from a Facebook friend of mine, who saw that the show was about to be axed and suggested I do something about it, with a petition specifically in mind. At first I wasn't too convinced, but I have to say the Internet showed just how powerful it can be. The number really amazed me: we're at over 17,000 signatures in less than two days. It would seem like a truly outsized result, if it weren't for the fact that people sensed something: beyond the single show itself, to which a great many people were clearly attached because it had become a late-night point of reference for a very large group of people, a broader debate has opened up about the value of culture on television. Naturally, I only deal with one slice of culture as a whole, but the idea of bringing good music to TV has been a reason for living for me, as well as a job.

Why is it so hard to make music programmes on Italian TV?

It's a debate that involves culture in the mass media and within Rai itself, which has always had this underlying problem: what is public service broadcasting? Is it about informing? Is it about meeting the need to help viewers grow culturally too? Should it instead aim at entertainment, since it's now part of a market competing for advertising? What space does music deserve? And is music contemporary culture, or is it simply entertainment? We obviously believe it's contemporary culture of a high standard. In short, a debate has opened up that, if approached the right way, without personal agendas, could be very useful for everyone, including Rai itself. Certainly, seventeen thousand people signing a petition in two days, taking the time to do so (even just to sign, leave their details, add a comment, and so on) is a clear demonstration that there's evidently a large slice of the audience that Rai doesn't take into account, but which is in fact very attached to that kind of programme.

Is it true, by the way, that "Ghiaccio Bollente" didn't have lower ratings than the channel average?

"Ghiaccio Bollente" actually had higher ratings, in terms of share, than the channel average, and it cost very little to make...

Music programmes used to have a stable place in the schedules of mainstream channels, but today they've become something like mission impossible, even on channels devoted to culture like Rai 5...

This is part of the wider debate. I think there's a tendency to reward relatively easy listening; there is room for music, but it's never structured in an organic way. Fazio, for instance, hosts major music figures, as do many others. We, however, were an organic proposition — weekly, continuous, consistent — built around music that's different from the mainstream, from what appeals to the masses, even though we've had major guests like Ligabue and Guccini. We've always kept an eye on what's new, but we also like to put things in historical perspective, to trace a musical phenomenon back to its roots. When you cover Nina Simone, say, you also end up explaining the whole struggle against American apartheid. This interweaving of history and music is generally underrepresented on TV, and I have to say it was perhaps the thing I loved most about the show.

And then there's the prejudice that keeps raging against pop-rock music, compared to untouchable sanctuaries like classical and opera...

It's a very old debate... Music today — not just rock, but contemporary music as a whole, the kind listened to right now around the world — has several levels: a low one, very commercial, perhaps of little artistic merit but maybe of great popular appeal (we've all fallen for a silly song at some point); and then there's a very high one too, which is our contemporary music. Whether you call it jazz, rock or pop doesn't matter — it has the same dignity as classical music. After all, who can say that Pink Floyd aren't our contemporary classical music?

In the '80s I never missed an episode of your "Mister Fantasy". A show that already back then seemed incredibly ahead of its time, and would still be so today. But wasn't that Rai, too, ahead of the one we have now?

Even "Mister Fantasy" actually came about a bit by chance. It was a project dreamed up by Paolo Giaccio and his mentor, the director Brando Giordani, who "let the kids play," even though we were all thirty years old... Those were the years when the video clip phenomenon exploded, and we managed to ride the wave. Besides, television back then was a completely different world — private channels had just launched... What I can say is that the executives of the time had real culture, and lived at a moment when culture mattered. My directors — Valmarana on the radio with "Per voi giovani" and Giordani on TV — were two people who not only knew how to make television, but also had a cultural vision of what making television meant, and that, perhaps, has been somewhat lost over time.

We obviously hope you manage to get back on Rai 5 with “Ghiaccio Bollente”. If that doesn't happen, what would you like to do?

If that doesn't happen, there are two paths: either try to keep making television that way, or make programmes differently, on the Web, through apps, for instance.

Well, I was saving this final question for the pioneer of internet on TV (with Rai Educational's “MediaMente” from 1995 to 2002) even before the music journalist: can there be a future on the Web for music journalism that's been pushed out of TV schedules?

The internet isn't yet a mature medium for the masses, but it certainly is for a certain segment of the audience. Funding is needed there too, you can't do everything for free. If you wanted to make the same kind of television, you'd need almost the same expenses required to make a programme in a proper studio. Sure, if you just want to do commentary from your desk at home, then it costs nothing, but that's not what I'd want to do. I'd want to make programmes that have proper resources… Resources aren't essential, but they're very important for making good programmes. And we're talking about limited resources anyway: we'd cost a fiftieth of what a Rai primetime programme can cost.

There are far bigger wastes of money at Rai, one might say… Anyway, as representatives of music journalism on the web, we'll keep supporting you, including by promoting your petition.

Thanks for everything, and greetings to OndaRock's readers!

(23/12/2015)

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