Pinegrove - The Shapes of Emotion

First of all, thank you for such a compelling, heartfelt album. Pinegrove are of course known for their emotional charge, but on "Marigold" I sensed an irrepressible need to communicate, more so than on your other releases – it's an album that vibrates with life, and one of the most defenseless I can recall. Does that description ring true to you?

It was important for me to make something emotionally direct. I'm always trying to refine and sharpen the way I communicate as an artist (and as a human being). This time I let myself be guided by emotional urgency.

This is the first material written and recorded after your hiatus, if I'm not mistaken. What can you tell us about the years leading up to the release of "Marigold" and how they interact with the songs?

The emotional space I was writing from was more deliberately patient than in past attempts. Since I felt misunderstood by the media response to my situation, it was especially important for me not to respond with a reaction. So I tried to make an album that, yes, deals with conflict and resolution (as any work of narrative art does), but with the aim of making something that would speak to anyone going through a hard time and in need of an encouraging word. So these songs obviously draw on the period I spent away from the road. But they're not meant as diary entries. They're meant as notes of encouragement for anyone who might need them.

Were there any particular works of art that helped you through this period?

I listened a lot to Ben Seretan's instrumental project "My Life's Work", which is made up of 48 tracks, each 30 minutes long (for a total of 24 hours), each one lingering on and playing a single chord. It was the perfect kind of music to help me think. And then of course Kacey Musgraves' "Golden Hour" changed my life.

Pinegrove's geometric artwork is known for carrying meaning, with previous covers orbiting around the concept of the square, the frame. These shapes have become iconic symbols in their own right, to the point that fans have gotten them tattooed. Color itself has always mattered too (red for blood, etc.). Can you tell us about the different artworks and what inspired the "pixelated" cover of "Marigold"?

All the instances of the square in our artwork are meant as a shorthand for talking about art itself, or about communication. “Skylight”, for example, is meant as a tribute to art – how versatile it can be, letting us escape or deepen our relationship with ourselves and with others. Offering comfort, posing a challenge. And a window to observe the process. The artwork for “Marigold” is zoomed into a pixellation of a sort of mind that has a bloom of rectangles floating across it – a photograph of a synapse. 

A few years have passed since the general moment of public upheaval regarding relationships between men and women. I know Pinegrove have shown themselves to be full supporters of the cultural shift the movement wanted to convey. Do you think anything has really changed since 2017?

I think that, on a small scale, we've seen a lot of people rethink how they interact with others, especially in romantic relationships. So I believe, as far as I'm qualified to speak on the subject, that there are reasons to be optimistic. But in other cases, especially in the American political landscape, I feel really demoralized seeing the language of solidarity and community so cynically manipulated to protect the status quo. But we're also seeing a much deeper, more complex commitment to building equal relationships among younger generations, and I expect that trend to continue.

One of the singles from “Marigold”, “Phase”, has been described as a song about insomnia. Do you suffer from it often, and what are your mental strategies for falling asleep?

I have trouble falling asleep sometimes. One thing I've found that helps is these Michael Sealey YouTube videos – hypnotic audio that guides you into a calm space and helps you drift off to sleep.

Your passion for pop music is well known, and I think “Marigold” is your most melodic album. Is that something you actively work on as a songwriter?

Thanks. Melodic control is something I aim for, in a way; but I think it's mostly a subliminal process. Honestly, I mostly rely on my own judgment or instinct to figure out whether a song is finished, whether it's exciting or engaging. One thing I can say is that I try to give each song its own melodic signature, so that when I repeat melodic motifs to address something on a semantic level – small recurring ornaments that act as vehicles of meaning across songs – those songs can stand out more against that shared backdrop. 

After releasing “Skylight” independently, you're now with the British label Rough Trade. What has your experience with them been like?

Working with Rough Trade has been fantastic, they've been supportive in every way. I think part of the reason they were interested in us was because they wanted to expand their presence in America. They have an office in New York, and we've mostly worked with that team (though the people in the UK have been great too!). So yes, historically Rough Trade is British, but they're doing great work on this side of the ocean too.

In a line that defined you in one of your early interviews, you said “being a good artist and being a good person are very similar concepts”. How do you see “Marigold” in that light?

Both being a good person and being a good artist mean communicating honestly. For me, being a good artist starts with treating the subjects I want to address with kindness. It's about opening up a space to imagine beauty and to honor emotional complexity. I've found a lot of overlap in my own life, and I'm striving to find an approach that's both energetic and gentle, both in my artistic practice and in my relationships.

Thank you for your time. Can you promise us you'll come play your songs in Italy in the near future?

We can't wait! Take care.

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