Papangu - Music for the Climate Apocalypse

The Brazilian Papangu have written one of the most ambitious debuts of the year, an eccentric concept album, sung entirely in Portuguese, which tells the story of a cangaceiro who has a vision of his own future and, in order to change it, resorts to a sacrifice. Starting precisely from “Holoceno”, we explored the world of this band from northeastern Brazil, who sing about the climate crisis and love Magma.

It seems to us that you've become one of this year's surprises in the metal scene with your debut “Holoceno”, so first of all, do you consider yourselves a metal band? How would you describe your music to our readers?
Marco Mayer (bass, vocals, guitar, keyboards): I don't think we're necessarily a metal band. While we clearly show our influences, we're a bit wary of letting ourselves be boxed in by genre labels. But that doesn't mean we throw everything together like we're making a collage of different genres: we love things like Mr. Bungle, Naked City and Estradasphere, but those guys are in a category of their own when it comes to extracting, from a blend of musical languages, individual styles that somehow remain intact. We're certainly not that skilled, and anyway we wouldn't be interested in imitating them. Our sound is more like a stew, as if you put all the things we love into a cauldron and let it simmer long enough for the ingredients to dissolve and emulsify.
I'd say a more fitting description would be to consider us a progressive rock band, and that comes with a few caveats too – clearly, we're nothing like Yes or Rush, and we're not the stereotypical image of stoned rockers wearing capes and worshipping Tolkien. And even though we play heavy, complex stuff, we're nothing like Dream Theater; quite the opposite, actually. For those who haven't heard us yet, try imagining a melodic riff from bands like Clutch and Mastodon mixed with the rhythmic playfulness of Magma and mid-70s King Crimson, but with melodies and rhythms from northeastern Brazil. On this record we also play around with some of the scales and harmonies used by Igor Stravinsky during his so-called "Russian period" and by Béla Bartók. Even if you're familiar with those individual artists, it might not be easy to put a sound to this description, so give our record a listen and see how it goes.

Hector Ruslan (electric guitar, vocals): Yeah, I don't see us as a textbook example of a metal band. We listen to a lot of different things that end up showing through in our music. Sure, metal plays a huge role in that. We've got doom-metal influences, sludge-metal influences, black-metal influences, and the list could go on. You could definitely say we're a metal band, but you could also point out, just like Marco said, that we're some kind of aggressive prog-rock band. To me it's a matter of opinion and it doesn't affect our goal much, which is to create the kind of music we like to listen to, whether that's metal, prog, rock, or something else.

The complex narrative of "Holoceno" involves a ritual sacrifice, a Faustian pact and other twists. How did the band write such an intricate story, and what literature did you draw on for inspiration?
Hector: It all started as a vague concept and began to evolve as the songwriting process went on. We knew we wanted to tell a story featuring various elements, places and traditions from the region we come from. We're from a poor state in the northeastern region of Brazil called Paraíba. It's a place historically marked by social inequality, violence and tensions around the environment, so we wanted to use all these elements, together with some influences from occult and science-fiction literature that we enjoy. So as the actual songs were being written, we'd discuss the feel of that song, the kind of lyrics that would best suit it, and what they would tell within the context of the album. Another major influence on us was literature dealing with Brazil's northeastern region. There are classic books by great authors that tell the kind of story involving the struggles of the vaqueiro or the cangaceiro (a sort of local version of cowboys and outlaws) against hunger, migration, drought, violence, and so on. "Morte e Vida Severina" by João Cabral de Melo Neto and "Vidas Secas" by Graciliano Ramos are two highly influential works that I'd recommend.

Magma seem to be one of your main influences, and they're one of the less common ones in the prog-metal scene. What do you think is so unique about them, and why is their zeuhl sound important to your music?
Marco: I'd say the rhythm and the way they play with tension are absolutely unique, and they place them very, very far from the pomposity and peace-and-love hippie vibe that comes from groups like Caravan, Yes and Genesis (although the latter are more theatrical than hippie, we know). I love those bands but, you know, no other band can play the same ostinato for 12 minutes before exploding into the most cathartic climax you've ever heard in your life (I'm talking about their 1971 piece "Theusz Hamtaahk"). I've always chased that rollercoaster-ride feeling in music, and I'd be lying if I said I didn't also want to make music that made me feel that way. The rhythmic drive in Magma's music is also somewhat similar to Afro-Brazilian music, especially when it comes to syncopation and propulsion, so I feel there's a certain convergence between those two entities that came together quite naturally on "Holoceno", especially on songs like "São Francisco". Still, no one can ever come close to what Christian Vander and his entourage managed to achieve – we certainly can't, because he's a musical genius – but we want to make adventurous music within our own language, and Magma's music is a huge inspiration for us.

Hector: I think Magma's sound is very aggressive. They have the ability to sound almost like a choir of alien priests or a death cult of wicked satanists. That's something I like about their music. They're very different from classic prog-rock bands that play a somewhat more cheerful, quirky kind of music. My favorite prog-rock band is probably King Crimson, and I also find their sound to be very different from other prog-rock bands because when they decide to go heavy, they really go heavy.

The ecological crisis is one of the main themes of "Holoceno", and it's undeniable that a political message resonates throughout the album. Would you consider Papangu a politically active band?
Hector: The answer to this question depends on what you consider a politically active band to be. "Holoceno" has a political and environmental backdrop that relates to what our country is going through right now. Even though we don't sing in slogans or protest lyrics, there's a clear message on our record for those who are listening more closely. Personally, I think the environmental crisis is the biggest challenge that human beings, as a collective group, are facing right now. We come from a place where you see people walking barefoot for miles in search of water. I believe that some of the struggles that northeastern Brazilians face every day are a taste of what will happen to many people around the world if we don't make the environment a priority right now. That said, within Papangu there's also room to write about our own feelings and struggles, as well as about occult myths from our origins, our people, our places, and so on.

"Holoceno" is sung in Portuguese and draws inspiration from Brazilian literature. It's also influenced by the musical tradition of northeastern Brazil. What is Papangu's relationship with their country? Would you consider switching to English in the future, to reach a wider audience that doesn't speak Portuguese?
Raí Accioly (electric guitar, vocals): Historically, the culture of Brazil's northeastern region has been undervalued or even marginalized, and now, with the positive response the album is getting, we see this as an opportunity to do what we love and show people the hardships and stories of our region through a new lens. Based on that, I don't think we'll be making that switch to English, because we believe our language and our accent are part of the identity of the songs we want to make.

Hector: While we were sending demos to labels, we were told that singing in Portuguese wouldn't appeal to American and European audiences. But we decided to do it anyway because it's an important part of our sound and we wouldn't want to do without it.

"Holoceno" is the result of 7 years of work, two of which took place during a pandemic. You've said in other interviews that a lot of that is down to a low budget and a bit of inexperience. Did you ever consider releasing something less complex, maybe an EP or a shorter album, to cut down on the time?
Raí: From the very beginning we had a narrative idea for the album and we wanted to follow it through. At the time we didn't know how many songs the record would contain, or that we'd have Benjamin Mekki playing saxophone, or that Toby Driver would remix one of our songs, obviously, but we knew we wanted to get from point A to point B. However, when Papangu started back in 2012, we lacked both the experience and the money to fund a project like this; after all, we were barely in our twenties, we had no jobs, and we'd just started university. Knowing our own limits, the only thing we could really do was rehearse and write. I believe it was in early 2016, when we all landed internships (which meant having a bit of money), that we started thinking about recording some demos. Once we had the demos recorded, we started seeing things more clearly. Still, since we all had our own personal commitments, we never felt the need to rush the recordings and put out a product, so, with that mindset, we kept playing our old demos and writing new material. Things changed in mid-2019, when Marco got a job offer in another state. Since he'd be leaving in less than six months, we wanted to finish our project. By the end of that year, we had recorded all the guitars, keyboards and vocals, and we were aiming to record the drums in March 2020, but the pandemic hit right after Nichollas started recording his parts. And that's the point where I think our lack of experience started slowing the project down.
We had to rethink how to record the drums and who would mix/master the album, and we didn't know how to do it remotely, so we wasted precious time and money. Based on that, I don't think it ever crossed our minds to change the project's original concept, especially because, even with all these difficulties, once we found a solution to the problems, the process went so well that we knew for sure we were making something we'd love.

As a bonus track on "Holoceno", available only on Bandcamp, we can hear a remix made by Toby Driver: how did you get in touch with him, and how did this collaboration come about?
Hector: Having Toby Driver remix one of our songs is something I'm really happy about. It all started with Marco, our bassist, who's a huge fan of Maudlin of the Well and Kayo Dot. He's actually the one who introduced me to Toby Driver's music, and I'm glad he did. Marco got to know Toby through email exchanges during his many years as a fan of his music, and that's how he asked him to remix one of our songs, originally called "Bacia Das Almas". Toby's remix is called "Açogue Das Almas" and it's included as a bonus track exclusively for those who buy the album on Bandcamp. Personally, I really like it. I often put that remix on while I'm driving. I think it's fantastic.

Here in Italy, not everyone thinks of Brazil when it comes to rock or metal. Probably the name most commonly associated with Brazil in those genres is Sepultura, at least over the last 30 years. What's your relationship with them? Did they play a role in shaping you as musicians?
Raí: Well, Sepultura are a huge band, and I believe they've had their share of influence on our sound, after all they combined metal with indigenous instruments and rhythms way back in 1996, with "Roots". And that combination of folklore and local rhythms with the wickedness of heavy music is what I believe we're trying to achieve with our own sound.

Hector: Sepultura were one of the bands I always listened to when I was first introduced to the more extreme forms of metal. They had a huge impact on me and I've seen them live many times. A fun fact: I've met Andreas Kisser, Derrick Green and Paulo Xisto! I met Andreas backstage at a festival, and I met Derrick and Paulo at a Baroness concert. Like Raí said, they had a huge impact on metal music, and "Roots" was a turning point for them. These days I listen more to their thrash-metal period. Records like "Arise", "Beneath The Remains" and "Schizophrenia" are the ones I listen to most, along with the more recent "Machine Messiah".

Will we have to wait 7 years for Papangu's second album, or will it be easier now that you've received so much positive feedback from webzines and listeners around the world?
Nichollas (backing vocals, vocals): As already mentioned, one of the factors behind the long production time of our debut album was our lack of experience. When we started playing together, we were just teenagers messing around with music, treating it as a hobby. Over these 7 years, we've improved our knowledge of our instruments, composition and music production; as a result, we decided we were ready to record and release our music in 2019. Due to the Covid-19 situation, the release was then delayed. Another thing to consider is that our relationship has deepened, which opened the door to shared musical influences, helping us create wilder, more complex songs for "Holoceno". Of course, the positive feedback on "Holoceno" has given us a good adrenaline rush to play the album live once the whole Covid-19 situation settles down, and mainly to write new material. We already have an idea for a new album based on themes and songs that weren't included on "Holoceno".
That said, after our experience producing "Holoceno", we believe we can release a new album within the next two years. You'll probably be hearing new things from us sooner than you think.

Is there any chance of seeing you live in Italy in 2022, or at least somewhere else in Europe?
Marco: We can't say for sure about 2022, since a lot of venues are already booked up with shows that had to be postponed because of the pandemic, but we're trying to put together a European tour for 2023, hopefully with new material to present.

One last, but important, question: what's your perception of Italian music? Are there any groups or musicians you listen to that come from Italy?
Marco: I think what I love most about Italian music is the richness of its melodies and the care with which Italian musicians build stories through sound; I'm no expert, but maybe that could be due to the influence of the Italian classical music tradition? I feel there's something similar in Italian rock, at least in prog-rock. I'm a big fan of the Italian progressive rock scene, with Demetrio Stratos's Area, Alphataurus and projects with Paolo Botta and Francesco Zago among my all-time favorites, but I also love Italian classical music: Giuseppe Verdi, Giacinto Scelsi and Luciano Berio. I also really like the 2005 debut by a band from Genoa called Calomito. Hector and I also love Goblin a lot, and he saw Mike Patton perform live with Mondo Cane!

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